On average, how many hands do you get per hour in: Holdem, 7 Stud, Omaha?

Answer 1:

In San Diego, I tracked the # of hands per dealer (per 1/2 hour) over a 3 month period, as part of the dealer’s performance evaluation. The results for Hold’em and 7-stud H/L…. Top dealers were averaging 19 hands in Hold’em
Bottom group was averaging 17 hands.
For Stud H/L
Top dealer averages 17
Bottom dealer 14.
Of course the number of players at the table and how fast they act on their hands has an affected on the #’s.

Answer 2:

Depends on the dealer, the table and the limits. My best guess is
Hold’em 35
7 Stud 25
Omaha 30

Answer 3:

Actually, the higher limits move faster. The button charge games have more chips in the pots(dollar chips in the 3&6) and more players have to put chips in the pot before cards are dealt: the two blinds and the button collection. Also, generally, the players in the yellow chip games and above are more experienced and act faster on their hands.

Casino game. Bill bets, I raise, Joe folds. No one in the pot now but Bill and I.
My understanding is that Bill and I can raise each other until we are out of chips on the table.  The rationale for removing the cap is that neither of us can get “caught in the middle.” In other words, Bill or I can stop the raising on our turn with a simple call. I keep having dealers tell me that if a third player was in the round at any point, the betting gets capped at three raises. Do I misunderstand the rule and the rationale behind it?  

Answer 1:

No, you understand correctly. However, as always, **local rules prevail**!!! In most card rooms, if there are only two active players remaining in the hand *at the time when the last raise (what would ordinarily be the cap) is reached*, there is no cap.  however, some card rooms insist that a cap will be placed on the betting if there were more than two active players in the hand *at any time during the betting round*.

Answer 2:

Yes, most good houses have this rule. It is to protect the third player if the other two are partners.

Answer 3:

I know at the Taj Mahal in AC that the betting can only be capped if they’re three or more players in the hand.  If the third player folds after the betting is capped that’s it for that round.  Once the betting is capped it cannot be “uncapped”.  If the third player folds prior to the cap the betting is unlimited between the two remaining players.

Since Canterbury opened I’ve been tracking my results. In 11 hours of 6-12 hold’em, I’ve recorded a win rate of 4.8 bb/hr. In 15 hours of 10-20, I’ve averaged a loss of 4.6 bb/hr. Needless to say; I’m inclined to stick to 6-12 from now on. But do these numbers really mean anything yet? It seems like my style of game works better against the more passive 6-12, and it seems like I’ve had great cards at 6-12. Conversely, even other players at 10-20 have commented on how unlucky I have been there. I think there is a psychological factor in play now, too, right now I feel like I just cannot win at 10-20 no matter what. Any advice (other than “seat open in my 10-20 game”)? Is there a huge leap in the nature of the players and the game from 6-12 to 10-20, or am I putting too much stock in the results of too few hours of play? I think I’m going to play 6-12 exclusively for many hours and see what kind of long term win rate I can maintain.

Answer 1:

If I told you the truth about how many hours of poker you need to play before you can be confident that your results mirror what’s expected, you’d crawl into a corner and die. So, I’ll just tell you that there probably aren’t many regular big-winning, long-time players who haven’t lost money over a 500-hour period. There are many big winners who claim they haven’t, however. But they don’t keep records. Part of the reason for the large fluctuations are that game conditions are not stable and players tend to divide their time among different limits. The closest I ever came to stability of outcome was 25 years ago in a $5 ante, $20 straight limit draw poker game. I never had a losing month over two or so years.

Answer 2:

The number of hours you need to play before you can determine whether you have a statistically significant positive win rate depends on two things, under the usual set of assumptions: The size of your win rate itself, and the standard deviation of your hourly win rates. If the former is small (close to 0) and/or the latter is large, the number of hours you need to determine significance can be quite large. In fact it is quite large even if those are not the case. As a rule of thumb: with a win rate of around 2BB/hr with a typical SD, you’d probably need to play at least 100 hours. If you were a more mediocre player with a larger SD, you might have to play for years!

Answer 3:

Others have already said, these results are almost meaningless for purposes of determining in which game you have the highest EV. I have been playing the low limit games out at Canterbury (4/8 and 6/12). I have avoided the 10/20 because I don’t have the bankroll to play in these. But based on my observations the 10/20 is not typically tougher than the 6/12. In fact, some times it seems that the opposite is true. I have avoided the 6/12 a few times because I did not like the looks of the game and figured that I’d be better off in any 4/8 game. The one time I did play it, it was a very nice game with at least one pure calling station and several loose players. Later in the evening I saw the calling station in the 10/20 game trying to get even. Many of the 6/12 players seem to be rocks that play well, but don’t want to risk the higher games. Tight cautious players can be exploited but not as easily or for as much as loose aggressive ones. If your bankroll can handle it, I would keep one eye on the 10/20 game at all times and jump in when it looks especially soft. I think that you have jumped to the wrong conclusion if you think that the 6/12 is significantly better than the 10/20.

I haven’t been playing Texas Holdem long and would like some advice please. I play competitions of pot limit Texas Holdem. Usually there are about 70 to 90 players at the start. Final table is made when down to last 10. Now here is where I seem to be struggling. In my last 15 visits. I have made the final table 8 times…….. Yet in these visits I cant finish higher than 6th (and usually only this high as a couple of players reach the final with only antes.). Now during the open play I play loose to a little tight. Can usually read a percentage of the other players. I limit my buying as much as possible. On the final table I tighten my game up. But I do believe it is my poor play causing the problem and not excuses like a bad run, no cards, outdraws etc. If anyone could give me a guideline on the best way to play a final table of pot limit HE I would really appreciate. I do read the postings here and generally feel I play the same sort of cards that are suggested, although I probably really play cards like 8 9 far too much. Would also like to know the basic principles of position play. I know I do not do this right.
Answer 1:

First of all Mav, making the final table in over half the tournies indicates not much wrong with your style of play. Maybe you need to work on your stamina, maybe you get nervous at the final table, and maybe the players there are better than you, whatever. It may, despite your self-deprecating statement to the contrary, be due to factors beyond your control. 8 final tables is not a very large sample size, and you may indeed have got card dead or been outdrawn unluckily several times. As for a guideline, just stay out of trouble. Tighten up a bit at the start of the ft. Maybe you should gamble it up a bit more earlier on so that if you do make the final table, you get there with a large stack and some margin for error. On checking your post again, you seem to be doing all this already. Just keep your mind clear and focused, believe in yourself, and you will win.

Answer 2:

I do think I tend to get nervous on a FT, why Im not to sure….not really my character. Re gambling more early, I do usually take a fair few chips to the final. Am nearly always in top 4 for chips at start of FT. The one area I am really looking at is that I get pushed out of pots…i.e. If I raise and someone re-raises I then debate my hand too much. Where as (I think I read it here) If it’s good enough to raise with then it should be good enough to call a re-raise with generally. As you say, 8 out of 15 are good and I agree that possibly it is a bad run. Mixed with the fact after the 3rd and 4th visit to the FT I was starting to get really annoyed with myself for not get a satisfactory result, this has not helped matters on each visit after.

Answer 3:

Well, if you can maintain that rate of top 10 finishes I wouldn’t worry about my play up to the final table. Raise or fold – don’t call. Tightening your game up at this stage is only right if you’ve been playing much too loose before but the important thing is to be aggressive. Winning the blinds is critical at this stage.

Well, I played 2-4 (50c ante) stud at Canterbury Thursday, Friday, Saturday, and Sunday, with a net win of $60 (+238,+15,-103,-90). This game is the loosest I have ever seen, even for a home game. Saturday and Sunday I went 3-4 hrs before winning a pot, since I was playing fairly tight, their were at least 6 people in with me on the hands I did play, and the play was fairly slow. Those first pots were $100+ pots though, and they are not all that unusual. Shuffling the burn cards because we are out of cards happens fairly frequently, and we even have to use a community card 3-4 times a night. What changes should I make to my game to deal with this extreme
looseness? I have been playing a little looser on 3rd and 4th street (playing 2 large live cards, 1 gap straights, small live pairs, total crap when I’m bored, etc), and tightening up on 5th street. It seems pointless to continue with a lone pair of kings after 5th against 4-6 other people, since kings-up will probably end up a losing hand. I’m starting to feel that I need very live ways to improve to at least aces-up to bother playing past 5th street. One thing to note about these games is there is no effective way to limit the field early. The bring-in is a dollar, and the first bet just completes it to two, so you’re only able to raise a dollar. Almost no one folds to that extra dollar, and the fact that you’re raising gives a fair amount of info to the few decent players at the table. Besides, with the antes and the dollars already in, most people probably have reason to call for a card. I wish we could raise the bring-in for a full $2 bet. No one would fold, but at least they’d have to pay a decent amount. Has anyone got any good advice for these games? I think that the best starting hand for this game is a high three flush. A pair of aces is still good, but unless you get a full house it is unlikely to win. Aces-up will win enough to be profitable, but will probably get beat 2 out of 3 times.

Answer 1:

I am not much of a stud player. Hopefully stud players will answer also. However, seems to me 3 flushes are good starters, high pairs when both your pair and kicker are totally live, 3 straights only if all cards two from either end are live, and of course trips (even if the case card is dead).

Answer 2:

When a low-limit stud game is loose and passive with five or more people seeing the last card, you have to ask yourself, ‘I know that my two pair on fifth street had an advantage over the various draws, but isn’t it more possible that one of my four remaining opponents has made a draw?” Normally you don’t have to outrun the bear, but in this case, the bear isn’t going to be done with dinner until he has eaten four out of five of the campers.

Answer 3:

It sounds like you have a good handle on this game and have made most of the adjustments I would normally recommend to people in a loose low limit game like the one you’re now playing in at Canterbury. A couple of other thoughts (some of which may be obvious). Forget about deception. With everyone calling to the River, you’re not going to win anything by being tricky. Players won’t fold marginal hands so you won’t gain by bluffing or trapping. However, you may be able to value raise more frequently because you won’t thin the field with your aggressive play. So don’t worry about knocking people out in those rare situations where you’re rolled on Third Street or Fourth Street. Similarly, you might want to value bet come hands more frequently with hands like four flushes and high four straights on fourth or fifth street. The fundamental skill, patience, you seem to have. That’s the key in these games for me.

You are at the final table of the WSOP Championship and are in the big blind with pocket aces. There are 3 other players. Each of you has the same amount of chips. The utg player goes all in…The button goes all in…The small blind goes all in. First place pays $1.500, 000.00; second place $1,000,000.00, third place $750,000.00 and fourth place pays $500,000.00. What do you do and why?!

Answer 1:

Fold them and make sure to show everyone there that I mucked aces, and then before the hand is over explain to everyone why I did it to prove how smart I am and that I know how to play every hand in every situation, because that’s what any good poker player would do. Seriously, play them. You’re probably at 50% or better odds to win against 3 random hands, and probably significantly better odds against their likely hands (like Ax and pocket pairs.

Answer 2:

Before the hand is dealt, your expectation is (1500000/4 + 1000000/4 + 750000/4 + 500000/4) or 375000 + 250000 + 187500 + 125000 = $937500. By folding your expectation becomes 375000 + 750000 for reasons that I can’t be bothered to explain, for a total of $1125000. Your expectation is affected by calling, but I can’t be bothered to think about that, because you obviously fold and move up two places in the rankings. You then burst into tears as it turns out you would have won anyway, as your opponents all turn over 2-3 off, and explain that they went all in “just for the hell of it”. You rapidly go on tilt, and lose the heads-up match when you go all in with those same aces, get called, flop a wheel and find that your opponent called with 2-3 off again and flopped a six-high straight. You go to a NL side game, buy in for your million dollars prize money, go all in with 2-3 off and get called by aces. Two more aces come on the flop.

Answer 3:

You are up against another pair of AA, and KK ,KK you cannot lose and you want half the chips to play the other guy who holds AA of course you could win it all right there if you make a flush or lose if it comes his flush. The other way is to throw away. But then the guy with the AA will have a 3 to l chip lead on you but you will have second place.

With reference to Pai Gow Poker, as played in a casino:
QUESTION #1
I know that you form two hands with your seven cards – a five card poker hand and a two-card poker hand. Does this also mean that you place two separate bets on the table? IF SO, how do you do this since there is only one numbered circle where you are supposed to place your bet. IF NOT, how are the bets split if you win one and lose the other? (Or is that a push and no money exchanges hands?)
QUESTION #2
Is more frequent in a casino to see the dice method used to determine the order the hands get dealt to, or do most casinos use an electronic random number generator?
QUESTION #3
Can anybody explain the Banker role to me? (I know this is not a simple question.) Is the dealer always the banker? Is the banker always the dealer? What about at home games? What about online games…in online games can the player assume the role of banker?

Answer 1:

>QUESTION #1
You only bet once. If the dealer beats both your 2 and 5 card hands, then the dealer takes your money. If you beat both the dealer’s 2 and 5 car hands, then you win. If you each win one, then it is a push.
>QUESTION #2
Most of the casinos I have been to in Laughling, use the digital counters (rotators). I have seen both in Vegas; however I couldn’t say which is used more.
>QUESTION #3
All the games that I have played have the house acting as banker. I am not sure, but I would venture to say that only places that can’t have a lot of table games (ie reservation casinos) might use a not house bank. Someone here will probably
be able to answer that better than I can.

Answer 2:

>QUESTION #1
There is only one bet. If the dealer wins both hands, you lose your bet. If you win both hands, you win even money minus a commission (between 5% to 10% depending where you play). It’s a push if you win one hand and lose the other. The 5-card hand MUST be higher than the 2-card hand (that means you cannot have a pair of Aces for the 2-card hand and a pair of Kings for the 5-card hand, etc.).
>QUESTION #2
The dice method is mainly to cater to the Asian crowd, who tends to have some distrust of electronic gages or believes that they’ll have more control the “luck” if dice are used.
>QUESTION #3

Playing as the banker means basically you’re taking over playing as the house. The other players are playing against you rather than the dealer. In order to play as the banker, you must put up enough money to cover all the bets on the table. If you catch a good hand, you can make a lot of money. If not, lose a lot. But I think it works out to better odds than making a big bet on a single hand because you may not lose to all the other players. Some casinos offer a special bonus where you put in an extra one or five dollars for what is called a “Fortune” hand. If your hand makes a straight or better, you win extra money. They usually have a chart on the table for the payoffs if they offer this.

Answer 3:

>QUESTION #1
Other people have answered this, but they’ve left out a significant detail. If your two card and/or your five card hand exactly ties with the banker, it counts as a banker win. Example:
You have: AA542 TT
Banker has: JJ987 TT
You win the five card hand, you tie the two card hand, the tie goes to the Banker. Therefore you each win one of the two hands, and the whole hand is a push. This is where the Banker gets their edge.
>QUESTION #2
In Nevada, the electronic RNG is much more common, in my experience. In California, the dice are more common, perhaps even exclusively used.
>QUESTION #3
Others have outlined the banker role. The dealer is not always the banker. In Nevada, the dealer will usually bank unless someone else asks to. In California, at small games, folks at the table will usually bank. At bigger money games, the banking will usually be dominated by a guy with an enormous mound of high valued chips.

I am a beginner to Hold ‘Em, and I was looking on Amazon.com, and I came across 2 books, by the same author, and I was just curious if anyone knew which book I should pick up, and if I should get both, which one first? Titles are: Hold’em Excellence: From Beginner to Winner AND More Hold’em Excellence: A Winner for Life The titles tell me I should go with the first one first……Is this true? I am just wondering if it is the same book, just a newer edition, as the 2nd one is 188 pages, compared to 159.

Answer 1:

Get the first one, along with Lee Jones’ Winning Low Limit Holdem. Read them, study them, apply the principles when you play. Then, get the second book, which I believe is the best holdem book in existence for somewhat experienced and mid-limit players (and not just because Lou Krieger pays me a royalty every time I recommend one of his books).

Answer 2:

I second that the Krieger books are worth reading, but would like to throw in Lee Jones’ _Winning Low Limit Hold’em_ (available at amazon, or www.conjelco.com, rec.gambling. Poker’s favorite gambling store. Extremely well written, and it’s the only poker book I’ve read where I’m willing to say you *will* be a consistent winner at the game if you apply the advice therein.

Answer 3:

You can read some of Lou Krieger’s Hold’em articles on his website. There’s information on all of his books, including his newest one, Poker for Dummies. Before the jokes on the “for Dummies” tag begin … I used to be a for Dummies” snob. The series title simply turned me off. After all, those framed brag thingies stuck in a box in my garage say I’m no dummy, right? Only I am…when I have to learn a new subject. I learned to appreciate the “for Dummies” books when I had to hurry up and learn Unix, Windows NT, networking, Photoshop and a few other subjects. Those “… for Dummies” books saved my tush more than once. In general they’re twice as informative and half as expensive as other books on any given topic. I wish Poker for Dummies had been available when I started playing poker six months ago. As it was, I was fortunate to be directed to Lou’s books as well as Lee Jones’ Low Limit book. One of the things I wanted Lou to include on his website was his recommendations for poker books.
Based on my own experience, I recommend confining yourself to one or two books MAXIMUM for the first month or two while you’re learning the fundamentals. I didn’t. Being a book junkie I went out and bought about 10 books and Turbo Texas Hold’em within about a month … and yes, I read them all! But I didn’t have (and still don’t have) the experience to evaluate the various (yes, the authors disagree!) philosophies. Thus I know tons of great information but I’m still stumped on what gets applied where. I had a really HUGE meal and it’s taking me a long time to digest it! Along with reading books, there’s a tremendous amount of great information available online on various websites and here in RGP. I must admit that my eyes glaze over when I read some of the stuff but I read it any way. Somewhere along the line I figure it will kick in and make me some money!

I know this is a basic question for most everyone, but I am consistently confusing the hand values in Omaha 8 or better hi lo split. Your help is appreciated. Which of the following hands is low and why? 

Hand a:               Ac 4c 8c 4h 

Hand b:               7s 3s 2s 8d 

Board cards:        10h  7c 8s Jc 5s 

Answer 1:

Well, player A has 8754A. Player B has 87532. 

Now, let’s say for a moment that they had two different hands: KQJT2 and KQJ98. Since player 1 has a higher fourth card, he would be high, correct? In the same way, Player B’s ’3′ is lower than player A’s ’4′. so Player B gets the low. 

Answer 2:

Or to fully explain: 

Hand a’s lo hand is: 
Ac 4c from hand and 5s 7c 8s from board. 
Hand b’s lo hand is 
3s 2s from hand and 5s 7c 8s from board. 

So a has a 8-7-5-4-A hand and b has a 8-7-5-3-2 hand. Therefore A’s hand is higher on the 4th card as a kicker. Therefore B gets the lo pot. (B also has the better high hand in playing for the hi pot). 

Answer 3:

Ace is the lowest card, but low hands are compared like all poker hands, first by type of hand (in this case, no-pair), then by rank starting highest-ranked in your hand. So, for 8754A, the A is the lowest card in the hand.  It’s used ONLY to break ties if both hands “start” with 8754. Your confusion isn’t that A is the lowest card, it’s that hands are compared using the high card first.  Aside from the fact that Ace is counted low and straights and flushes are ignored, the comparison is “worst 5-card hand”.  Figure out which no-pair hand would win if it were regular high poker, and give the pot to the other hand. Thus, 8765A loses to 76543 (straights and flushes are ignored for low, by the way).  The highest card is compared first, so it doesn’t matter that the 8-high hand has an Ace, the fact that it has an 8 kills it compared to the 7-high hand.

Is the 90 bucks worth it? As I mentioned in a previous post, I am a newbie, but want to learn as much as possible. The reviews I read make it look great, but lets be honest, the manufacturer’s website would not put negative reviews on there. Would you, an RGP reader, recommend it?

Answer 1:

If you are serious about becoming a good holdem player, then this software is absolutely a no-brainer “strong buy” recommendation.

Answer 2:

Download the demo version and see what you think yourself.

Answer 3:

If you question the recommendations, go play in the casino for a couple of sessions. Keep good records of the hands you play and those you don’t. If you are not ahead, spend the $90. Set it up as close to the conditions you have locally as you can and see what you learn. My point, loaded TTH, practiced for two days, played in a tourney after finding a HUGE hole in my game and came home $2,400 ahead. Was it a good investment, you figure it out for yourself, but it is a no brainer as far as I am concerned.